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What BOOK(s) are you reading?

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30 Oct 2016 17:35 - 30 Oct 2016 17:36 #237197 by Vlad
Replied by Vlad on topic What BOOK(s) are you reading?

Shellhead wrote: Another writer who is often guilty of the strategic surprise win in a battle is Jerry Pournelle. I like his stories featuring John Christian Falkenberg, but they do tend to involve Mary Sue levels of military genius antics. At least his portrayal of military life seems insightful. One thing that he explicitly talks about that should have gotten more emphasis in the Black Company stories: mercenaries need to fight carefully. They can't just throw away lives carelessly in battle, because they don't have the governmental authority to replace their ranks with a draft, and nobody wants to join a merc unit with a reputation for losing.


I only recently started with Falkenberg series, kind of ambivalent about them for the same reason. On one hand, the world is pretty realistic, at times almost boringly so. The same can be said about weaponry, troop morale, supplies, etc. It feels like reading an account of a real military operation in a low sci-fi setting. However, Falkenberg is such an idealized figure that at times the whole series strike as simply jingoistic. And although I generally enjoy Pournelle's signature twist of "a seemingly unethical solution is the only solution", there's at least one episode of Falkenberg's "heroism" too similar to the actions of the likes of Pinochet. And those things work out in the books in part because Falkenberg is competent to the point of near-prescience and in part because Pournelle really wants them to.

However, I greatly enjoyed nearly everything I read by Pournelle and Niven - with "The Lucifer's Hammer" probably my favorite post-apocalyptic book ever.
Last edit: 30 Oct 2016 17:36 by Vlad.
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30 Oct 2016 19:07 - 30 Oct 2016 19:08 #237200 by RobertB
Brian Daley's GammaLAW series is good military SF. You might have to get them on Kindle.
Last edit: 30 Oct 2016 19:08 by RobertB.
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31 Oct 2016 09:21 #237223 by Shellhead

Vlad wrote: However, I greatly enjoyed nearly everything I read by Pournelle and Niven - with "The Lucifer's Hammer" probably my favorite post-apocalyptic book ever.


You might enjoy Slow Apocalypse, by John Varley. It's a very realistic post-apocalypse book set in modern Los Angeles. Varley is a very imaginative writer, but he dials that way down for this book and focuses almost entirely on what is actually possible, aside from the initial cause of the collapse of civilization.
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31 Oct 2016 09:24 #237225 by Shellhead
I am currently reading Only Superhuman, by Christopher Bennett. It's about super-heroes in a relatively realistic near-future science fiction setting. The concepts are solid, but the quality of the writing is average. The main character is very stereotypical redhead babe with a wild temper. I have slogged through the first third of the book but might not be able to finish it unless the story or the writing improves.

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31 Oct 2016 09:28 #237227 by Mr. White
I'm reading Krokodil Tears, part two of Jack Yeovil's Demon Download cycle, and will write more on it in the Dark Future thread when done.

Sounds like I'd like to read Lucifer's Hammer at some point. Thanks for bringing it up!

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31 Oct 2016 19:37 #237258 by Vlad
Replied by Vlad on topic What BOOK(s) are you reading?
Going to pick Slow Earth next...

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31 Oct 2016 20:23 #237260 by Shellhead
I enjoyed Lucifer's Hammer, but I read it back in the day, and realize that it might seem a bit dated now. My favorite book by Niven and Pournelle is Inferno, a sequel of sorts to Dante's Inferno.

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31 Oct 2016 21:54 #237264 by Vlad
Replied by Vlad on topic What BOOK(s) are you reading?
I read Lucifer's Hammer several years, and it is still my favorite post-apoc. That's not to say it's perfect. The fact that, off all things, the nuclear plant survives the tsunami is overly optimistic, considering Fukushima. But I find the reactions of people, the organization, trade and politics to be very believable, as opposed to mad max/ walking dead (and they still have cannibals!).

Never got to Inferno, the premise seemed too ridiculous back in the day, but heard good things about it.

I wish there were more modern partnerships between sci-fi authors as fruitful as Niven-Pournelle...

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01 Nov 2016 02:06 #237271 by Cranberries
Lucifer's Hammer is fun, but feels like a novel-length diatribe against the Northern California hippy-human potential movement of the 1970s.

I just finished reading the Harry Potter series for the first time, after my daughters convinced me to start with the audio books. I'd seen the movies on vacation five years ago (sort of) but the books were great fun. Snape was even more tragic. Also, those centaurs and Umbridge. Yikes.

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01 Nov 2016 09:47 #237284 by dysjunct
I liked their THE MOTE IN GOD'S EYE back in the day although I don't know that it would hold up today.

I used to really like their FALLEN ANGELS for its fun tribute to fan culture, but the central conflict of the book (society has disintegrated into ice age feudalism due to anti-science trends buying into the "global warming" boondoggle) strained credulity in 1992 and has not improved.

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01 Nov 2016 10:29 #237286 by RobertB
craniac wrote:

Lucifer's Hammer is fun, but feels like a novel-length diatribe against the Northern California hippy-human potential movement of the 1970s.


It's been a long time since I read it, but that doesn't shock me. I also seem to recall inner-city folk flat-out turning into cannibals.

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01 Nov 2016 14:21 #237297 by Vlad
Replied by Vlad on topic What BOOK(s) are you reading?
Actually, the cannibalism was started by a group of soldiers on maneuvers or national guard or something, definitely the military.

However, there's one fairly explicitly black character in the book (I say fairly explicit, because Niven/Pournelle don't sate the race of their character - i think never - you can guess from the background, name, speech patterns), who is an uncomfortable inner-city stereotype with an uncomfortably typical (and very minor) character arc. The problem is that he's the only explicitly black character. On the other hand, most of Pournelle/Niven characters are stereotypes, so I prefer to attribute this to their lack of skill and effort in character study, rather than to casual racism.

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01 Nov 2016 14:37 #237298 by Vlad
Replied by Vlad on topic What BOOK(s) are you reading?

cranaic wrote: Lucifer's Hammer is fun, but feels like a novel-length diatribe against the Northern California hippy-human potential movement of the 1970s.


There is one hippie-ish community, that is sort of happy (initially) "to go back to Earth", grow their own food and have all their electrical needs fulfilled by a home-built wind generator. And, well... whatever happens to them is not a diatribe, it's part of the story and I'm pretty sure would have happened in real life, too.

And, by the way, stating that a particular way of life would not survive an apocalyptic event is hardly a diatribe against it. Like, I'm pretty sure I'd die in a matter of days if not hours (and in some horrible way, too) if this shit happens, but I still prefer that to being a survivalist. And, as far as I remember, Pournelle&Niven are not very kind to the survivalists either.

There's a great phrase in the book: "a civilization has the ethics it can afford", which I think sums up what it is about. And it definitely goes beyond the New Age movements, as well as current ideologies.
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01 Nov 2016 15:08 #237300 by engineer Al

dysjunct wrote: I liked their THE MOTE IN GOD'S EYE .


I agree. This was far and away my favorite by the pair.

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01 Nov 2016 19:04 #237318 by Vlad
Replied by Vlad on topic What BOOK(s) are you reading?
Mote in God's Eye is great, with no reservations or controversies.

The last time I read it, I had the Halo videogame imagery all over it - the human spaceships and weapons, and moties as the covenants. There is a long action scene by the end of the 2nd act that could have been a Halo level.

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