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Marvel Cinematic Universe Thread
- Jackwraith
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Michael Barnes wrote: leaning all the way into the Kirby crazypants BP run of the late '70s,
Leaning into Kirby crazy should almost always be done.
Still waiting on that Eternals movie with the full gathering of Celestials and a horde of Deviants...
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- Matt Thrower
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Doctor Strange
Guardians of the Galaxy
Captain America: First Avenger
[Logan doesn't count, but goes here]
[Significant quality drop]
[Deadpool doesn't count, but goes here]
Ant-Man
Spider-Man: Homecoming
Captain America: Winter Soldier
Iron Man
Captain America: Civil War
[Significant quality drop - can barely remember most of these]
Avengers
Thor
Avengers 2
Iron Man 3
Incredible Hulk
Thor: Dark World
Iron Man 2
I've not seen Guardians of the Galaxy Vol 2 or the third Thor movie.
The most interesting things for me about my list is how much I seem to like origin movies and how bad, in comparative terms, the ensemble pieces are.
It's also worh noting that, as someone who doesn't read a lot of comics, Captain America looks like one of the least interesting characters in the Marvel stable, yet he's formed the basis for the most consistant quality sub-franchise.
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- Michael Barnes
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Then Jack Kirby crashed in and made everything weird during 1976, around the time of Captain America & the Falcon #200. Yeah, the Bi-Centennial of America happened just one month before Cap #200.
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- Jackwraith
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Incidentally, Engelhart was also responsible for another character-defining run when he took over the Batman for a few months and introduced or reintroduced several elements that have had lasting impact on the character ever since (Boss Thorne, the homicidal Joker (in the best Joker story ever written: The Laughing Fish), etc.)
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Unfortunately, Englehart came back to Marvel and did mostly mediocre work there in the '80s. His work on Silver Surfer was okay, but his Fantastic Four was so-so and his West Coast Avengers was extremely disappointing.
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I want to watch GotG 2 again. I was disappointed the first time I watched it. The plot wasn't that interesting since it was basically the Futurama episode "A Bicyclops Built for Two." But I was sitting in an incredibly uncomfortable theatre and I think that was part of why I didn't care for it.
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- Matt Thrower
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bfkiller wrote: I think Doctor Strange is the most inconsistent of the Marvel movies. It has some glorious visuals and the martial arts angle is a bit refreshing (not that we haven't ever seen that in other super hero movies, though), but Strange is such an unlikable character in it and Cumberbatch gives such a TERRIBLE performance. No comedic timing whatsoever. Most MCU movies have great senses of humour but the jokes in this one fall flat pretty much every time.
Predictably, given my ranking of it at #1, I'm going to disagree. Strange being a bit of an anti-hero adds interest to me: I often find I have more sympathy and engagement with a flawed character. And I think Cumberbatch performs it well, although perhaps not at his best given his impressive work on other fronts.
I'll agree on the comedy front to some extent, although arguably Strange is playing the straight man to the rest of the characters. But the rest of the movies make up for that, and across the whole franchise, Strange is probably the setting and character that need it least.
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bfkiller wrote: I want to watch GotG 2 again. I was disappointed the first time I watched it. The plot wasn't that interesting since it was basically the Futurama episode "A Bicyclops Built for Two." But I was sitting in an incredibly uncomfortable theatre and I think that was part of why I didn't care for it.
I just rewatched it this week since it popped up on Netflix. I think I liked it even less than when I saw it in the theater (and I didn't like it all that much then). It's got some funny bits, but it commits the cardinal sin of splitting up the team. Why go to the trouble of assembling a fantastic, hilarious cast and then immediately split them up? That drives me nuts.
Also, Kurt Russell is fucking wasted in this movie, and this is simply unforgivable. Kurt Russell is automatically the best thing about everything he's in, and he's a complete non-entity in this movie. No sense of menace, no real humor, nothing. They turn him into yet-another bland MCU villain, no different from that dark elf guy in Thor 2.
My top 3 are:
Captain America: Winter Soldier
Avengers (maybe not the BEST movie, but I would argue the most entertaining)
Guardians of the Galaxy 1
I'm very curious to see how Marvel Studios navigates into the next phase, as some of the original actors decide they're done. Can Black Panther, Captain Marvel, and Dr. Strange serve as the faces of the franchise post-Avengers 4?? I dunno. That's some big shoes to fill.
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- Black Barney
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To borrow from Demolition Man: "In the future, all movies are Marvel superheroes."Black Barney wrote: omg i've had it with these movies and we're going to get way more of them it sounds like
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Black Barney wrote: omg i've had it with these movies and we're going to get way more of them it sounds like
Kevin Feige from Marvel Studios said recently they have 20 movies plotted out beyond Avengers 4. So yeah, they're not going anywhere. I mostly enjoy the MCU movies though, so I don't perceive that as a problem.
I do think it's interesting though, that Marvel has kind of created their own genre. They're not just "superhero movies" or even "comic book movies." They're "Marvel movies," with their own specific genre conventions and expectations. Kind of like how "Star Wars" is its own genre now too.
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- Michael Barnes
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Thinking back over it, all of this has been enabled by one critical piece that was also missing in the 80s and 90s when tentative efforts were made to do comic book films. It's TV. The success of serial (rather than purely episodic) TV shows like Lost, Breaking Bad, The Sopranos and so forth created a larger demand for persistently developing narrative. This is why there's always the hooks - as irritating as they sometimes are - to lead into the next film or to set up a story element or resolution for later. That interconnectedness simply wasn't found in films outside of a few major trilogies or franchises and even then there wasn't typical this sense of universe-building wherein the universe could support different genres and huge ensembles with completely fleshed-out storylines coming together.
It's significant when Thor, fresh out of Ragnarok and with a big tease at the end, shows up in the Infinity War trailer and meets up with the Guardians. It's huge, because it bridges those story arcs. It's just like the last page of a comics issue where there's a big reveal of an unexpected character.
It _is_ tiring, and it feels like they are just cranking these out. But there again- we're looking at something that has taken a decade to develop.
The big films, like I said are now the equivalent of AVX, House of M, Civil War, Secret Wars, etc.- the sort of superhero pageants that are really kind of the equivalent of the Universal monster mashes that were nowhere near the quality of the original Dracula/Frankenstein/Wolf Man/Mummy films.
It has been surprising that the B-list has turned out to be the such fertile ground- and so widely appreciated by mainstream audiences. Who knew GotG would be HUGE? I never imagined that. But the ability to take a risk on that was enabled by Avengers, Iron Man, and the other biggest hits. Now it is one of the biggest hits.
Joebot is correct that it is going to be a challenge for them to move past the original Avengers as they age out of the roles or lose interest in continuing with those characters. I think they've actually done well with establishing "successor" characters by elevating the B-listers like Black Panther and Doctor Strange.
I thought Cumberbatch was great as Doctor Strange. The character is an arrogant jackass that is terrible at relating to other people. It's not that much different than Sherlock, it's just not as nuanced a performance.
Anyway, I'm looking forward to Moon Knight, a Blade reboot, and a REAL Fantastic Four movie set in the 1960s directed by Brad Bird.
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