Lost Treasures of the Eurogames Reclamation Project

A blast from the past has finally gotten stocked at CSI.
Hotel Tycoon, the reprint of Hotels, is sitting in my cart at $27.
This is one I played decades back and remember enjoying it a lot. But I remember the toy factor the most and just how fun it was to buy and build the buildings. I had fun back then - Does the game still hold up?

Anyone have an opinion on Rum and Pirates? A few Sundays back the peeps at the game store were talking a game of R&P they just played and I remember it getting flack for being easy and feeling out of place for the Alea line. But that's all I know.

VonTush wrote: Who's got some opinions on O Zoo le Mio?

Dreadful. Nothing but blind bidding auctions, and they don't feel like they have any major stakes, so you don't get the good part of blind-bid auctions, where someone way overpays or gets away with a steal or something. Everyone's bidding between 2 and 5 (don't remember exact numbers, though, honestly).

Jeff White wrote: A few months ago we started taking the kids to the local stock car track because I've been able to get free tickets from one of the sponsors. We have a great time. It all reminded me of Detroit Cleveland Grand Prix and how it may be a good one to get for the family. This is also when talks of the ERP and Thunder Alley started happening.

This is the same system as Daytona 500 right? If I have D500 should I look at DCGP? One better than the other?

Yes, let's keep the good vibes flowing. The ERP exists outside and above all of that other nonsense.

Domaine is pretty nasty...I've seen more than a couple of people put off by it because they had their holdings chopped to bits over a smart play of a few walls. It's a game that really rewards experience and it kind of demands that you learn how to take advantage of certain situations. I think it's an awesome game, but it is pretty cutthroat.

I saw Hotel Tycoon and thought about it too...it looks cute, my kids are probably a little young for it and it looks like mostly a kid's game. It is cheap though, wouldn't be surprised if I have it in the next couple of months.

I actually don't have my original two copies of Settlers...I had the Mayfair first edition with the ghastly artwork. but then I found out about expansions, so I bought a full set of Siedler. Upgraded to the third English edition and that's still the copy I have.

Incidentally, Star Trek Catan is on clearance for $25. An F:AT benefactor sent me a copy for Christmas a couple of years ago, well worth accidentally dropping into a cart full of back-to-school items.

There are a couple of differences between DCGP/Top Race/Daytona 500. They all have a couple of changes, none of which really seem all that big of a deal. It seems like you could play any rule set on any track.

I'm excited that some people are irritated by it, that some folks are saying that I've "hit rock bottom" with this. I love that the AT dogmatists are furrowing their eyebrows at it. It's shaking things up around here, and it really is refocusing the conversation back to GAMES. Not the pros and cons of Kickstarter, the politics of expansions, miniatures painting, or whatever else. But the GAMES.

you're overstating this I think, nobody's irritated, there's no AT dogmatists here, just a couple people surprised at how heavily you are driving this conversation.

edit: screw it, no need for Kickstarter complaints here.

Michael Barnes wrote: Domaine is pretty nasty...I've seen more than a couple of people put off by it because they had their holdings chopped to bits over a smart play of a few walls. It's a game that really rewards experience and it kind of demands that you learn how to take advantage of certain situations. I think it's an awesome game, but it is pretty cutthroat.

It's definitely a game that requires everyone to be experienced with it; if there's even one player who's playing for the first or second time, I can pretty much guarantee you the game is going to end with that player finishing off fencing his domaine, only to realize that he's actually also finished off someone else's "almost half of the map" domaine, which is a pretty dissatisfying ending.

Man, I'm really curious about Witch's Brew now; but when I see the dinky little components, I can't bear paying so much for it. I never liked Citadels, and this looks like an interesting alternative. Anyone care to compare Citadels/Libertalia/Witch's Brew, all of which look semi-similar? Citadels actually has too LITTLE psychology/double-think for me.

I remember playing Hotels when I was eight or nine. Perhaps ten.
I'm pretty sure I'll click check-out sooner rather than later on it as I just happen to live with a 7 year old, going on 18. And with a quick call can have my 10 year old nephew over. And I do think it is going to be one of those games that blips and then disappears again. Especially since there wasn't going to be a US release at first.

Last night I started to watch Joel's review of Thurn and Taxis...No offense to Joel, but I kept dozing off. As soon as I shut off the video though I perked right back up. It just looked so, so, so boring. So that was the nail in the coffin that I'll never be interested in that one again.

Was there ever agreement with Jamaca? Good, Bad, Meh? That pirate racing game with great production?

scissors wrote: I'm excited that some people are irritated by it, that some folks are saying that I've "hit rock bottom" with this. I love that the AT dogmatists are furrowing their eyebrows at it. It's shaking things up around here, and it really is refocusing the conversation back to GAMES. Not the pros and cons of Kickstarter, the politics of expansions, miniatures painting, or whatever else. But the GAMES.

you're overstating this I think, nobody's irritated, there's no AT dogmatists here, just a couple people surprised at how heavily you are driving this conversation.

What makes you think I'm talking about anybody but you?

Thurn and Taxis sucks. That is a truly terrible game. The first time I played it, I sat there pretty much being a butthole about playing it and not really paying attention. I just kind of followed the rules and I won. At the end I was like "I won?" And everybody was monday morning quarterbacking the strategies and I was just like "I dunno, I just won".

Shellie commented that Jamaica is one of those simple designs with some needless complications add on top of it to please gamers...that sort of put me off from it.

scissors wrote: I'm excited that some people are irritated by it, that some folks are saying that I've "hit rock bottom" with this. I love that the AT dogmatists are furrowing their eyebrows at it. It's shaking things up around here, and it really is refocusing the conversation back to GAMES. Not the pros and cons of Kickstarter, the politics of expansions, miniatures painting, or whatever else. But the GAMES.

you're overstating this I think, nobody's irritated, there's no AT dogmatists here, just a couple people surprised at how heavily you are driving this conversation.

I love how the AT dogmatists are categorised as old, beard scratchy, furrowed eyebrows type fanatics who are way out of their depth. I am none of those things but feel free to generalize.

No, no, no. You just described Eurogamers.

You sir, are a GROGNARD.

VonTush wrote: Anyone have an opinion on Rum and Pirates? A few Sundays back the peeps at the game store were talking a game of R&P they just played and I remember it getting flack for being easy and feeling out of place for the Alea line. But that's all I know.

Pretty forgettable. It's one of Feld's simplest games and doesn't fall into the heavy euro category. It's also slightly too complex to be what I'd call a family game. As a light euro it's decent, but not particularly impressive.

dragonstout wrote: Man, I'm really curious about Witch's Brew now; but when I see the dinky little components, I can't bear paying so much for it. I never liked Citadels, and this looks like an interesting alternative. Anyone care to compare Citadels/Libertalia/Witch's Brew, all of which look semi-similar? Citadels actually has too LITTLE psychology/double-think for me.

I compared them a bit on page 6 of this thread. If Citadels has too little psychology/double-think for you then I doubt Witch's Brew would be an improvement.
Each round in Witch's Brew has each player choosing a hand of cards from their entire deck, and each player has an identical deck. So you can only use what players have in front of them (coins, vials, ingredients) to deduce their intentions. Like Citadels, your own motivations/intentions for the round are the primary governing force behind which cards you pick for your own hand.
During the round a player plays a card, then clockwise around the table players who want to play the same card do so and elect either the major action or minor action. The minor action is the safe action, but the major action is the good action that has a chance to be denied if another player reveals the same card after and chooses the major action for himself. If you have the same card as the played card and don't play it you can't play it later.
There's a tiered build process. Citadels has one currency and you use it to build stuff. Witch's Brew has 3 ingredients and you usually use combinations to build stuff. Focus too heavily on one ingredient and you both telegraph your intentions and limit your options. Coins and vials can be exchanged for each other and for ingredients and vice-versa. So in a way you have 5 currencies.
Witch's Brew isn't difficult, but Citadels is the cleaner game. DO NOT pay more than about $25 for Witch's Brew.


I like discussing ERP games because I came a bit late to the hobby and while I'm aware of most of these games, I don't know a lot about many of them.

Michael Barnes wrote: Domaine is pretty nasty...I've seen more than a couple of people put off by it because they had their holdings chopped to bits over a smart play of a few walls. It's a game that really rewards experience and it kind of demands that you learn how to take advantage of certain situations. I think it's an awesome game, but it is pretty cutthroat.

I would add that it can also get hard to "read" the board by the end. It's just a mess of little black fences and plastic horses.

Any other good post-Catan Teuber games that belong in the ERP? What about Elasund? That's the very rare game that my wife actually likes. It has some wonky concepts, like putting down "building permits" to mark where you want to build. You end up telegraphing your intentions ahead of time, which can be frustrating, but you can also do some fun bluffing with it. And it can get really nasty when you start bulldozing each other's buildings down.

My own ERP is heating up. It's transitioning from the "picking up old favorites" phase into the "discovering old games I never played in the first place" phase. Therefore, this thread is proving to be a tremendous resource.

Let's talk Wolfgang Kramer. He's responsible for some of my all-time favorites (El Grande, Torres, Pueblo) as well as a few titles I truly hope to never, ever touch again (PoF, Tikal), yet I've never experienced much of his late 90s/early 00s output. His work is quickly becoming the focus of the "Discovery" phase of my ERP. Anyone care to gloss the following: Java, Mexica, Tycoon, El Caballero, Goldland?

I really liked the Anno games he did, they were really cool exploration titles. If I remember correctly, you REALLY want the expansion with that.

Elasund and Candamir were both OK if I remember correctly. I think I only played Elasund a couple of times but Candamir somehow got played a lot for a while. I think Anno is probably the best of his post-Catan work. Man, I kind of want to get that now.

I think all of these are ERP-worthy. As well as some of those other pre-Catan Teuber games. I really want Die Fliegen Hollander and Drunter & Druber.