Tough read re: being a woman in the games industry

Sagrilarus wrote: It's not money, it's pacing. Those of us with kids have little interest in games with time pressure.

It is why *we* have issues with such games. But from their point of view, it's all about what's available to them. Here, a fresh graduate can earn as low as $150, making $50 game purchases a very expensive proposition. Now they can play the most popular genre on mobile, on devices they already own. However, the format also prevent them to be very involved. To a lot guys, the E3 revelations mean nothing. They only hear Witcher 3 in passing. Skyrim is a myth.

They're a very different generation, in how they view games.

SuperflyTNT wrote:

Sagrilarus wrote: It's not money, it's pacing. Those of us with kids have little interest in games with time pressure.

And I'm not sure why we're equating older with more likely to be predatorial. My last two run-ins were with younger men.

That’s what I was thinking. I’ve never, ever treated a woman with disrespect, especially sexually. I don’t even understand the concept of how men can feel entitled to say sexual shit like this guy apparently did. It’s classless, and for a gamer, it illustrates that dude has zero game when it comes to courting.

The younger dudes I know are more snide like that and would say crass shit as a pickup line.

My point got mutated, and I don't know how. I never said "younger people are less likely to be harassers", I said "the board game hobby isn't as old and grey as it appears on a web forum". I don't have any useful info to prove or refute the first statement at all. I never even tried.

What I have seen from younger gamers is more adopting this into their regular life (ie playing at work after hours) and less "open gaming" at game stores and cons. Maybe this means they're "less into the hobby", but honestly, that might be a good thing.

Like I said, if you're a dickhead at the office then even after hours it can have real-life consequences.

ubarose wrote: Video bashing Katie has over 2000 up votes. If you feel up to it, please report it so maybe YouTube will take it down.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?reload=9&v=kqHHm4kSaWY&feature=youtu.be

Big man with a microphone attacks someone helpless from a distance.

Someone needs to fuck him up a bit. Not hospital hurt but a small scar above his eye to remind him that speech has consequences.

The fact that I had several commenters on our BGG article complaining about the makeup on our female characters and even that they exist kind of says that yes, some dudes are shitheads.

Wife said it best and I’m quoting as she’s talking: “A lot of dudes are douchebags. Now you got fuckers who haven’t ever seen a vigina since they were escaping their mom’s... they don’t take showers and don’t have any lives and definitely no girlfriends...you got a lot of people there. If you’ve been to a game convention you know it’s like that. These guys are ‘desperation’. Not all guys are like that but you take the worst and bam, these guys get grabby. Now you got these chicks who dress up like kitty cats and shit and they don’t know how to act. You know? They just reach over and grab a tittie. Guys are douches. Some guys are gentlemen and some guys aren’t. You get harassed at concerts, bars.

If some geeky ass mother fucker grabs my ass at a game convention I’m going to say some shit and then laugh my ass off at those pathetic losers.”

God help them if they do it around me because there will be very little anyone else will be able to do to help them.

Also, Apple transcription sucks and I had to fix a bunch but my mouth to God’s ear, those were her words

Man, that youtube video is sickening. It's everything wrong about the situation.

Sevej wrote: Man, that youtube video is sickening. It's everything wrong about the situation.

The comments section is even more disturbing.

Sevej wrote: Man, that youtube video is sickening. It's everything wrong about the situation.

I'd like to report it (I haven't watched it, and I'd rather not) but it might help if I knew what others were reporting it for. There seem to be a lot of options and the form wants you to include timestamps.

I've not reported a YouTube video before (I don't use the platform much) and I can't help wondering if all these options are a purposeful speedbump.

I chose abuse to specific people. Bullying also seemed viable. I didn't concern myself with the timestamp being accurate, since it seems to start the abuse at 0:00.

I chose the option roughly equivalent to "attacking the vulnerable."

Of course it’s a speed bump. Moderation of videos is a resource-heavy nightmare and they don’t want to encourage it since lots of broadcasters like to report the competition. YouTube would rather just take down snuff films and that’s about it

SuperflyTNT wrote: Someone needs to fuck him up a bit. Not hospital hurt but a small scar above his eye to remind him that speech has consequences.

I think you'll agree that the little turd who posted that video wasn't raised well. I'm sure his father was either remote to him or couched everything in terms of a violent solution he couldn't live up to, because look at him.

Times that by the population of an entire country. That's a systematic problem.

He's online right now talking about who's ass he's going to kick. It's all pathetic whining. All of it.

Women need to run these spaces. They need to write the laws with their own needs and safety in mind. They don't need bodyguards, and men need to shut the fuck up about it. My wife: "that sounds pretty good." Full stop.

Sevej wrote: Man, that youtube video is sickening. It's everything wrong about the situation.

It is a fantastic example of the cottage industry that has been built around nerd-hate.

Here's the thing, this video has about forty thousand views and hundreds of comments. Hundreds of very engaged comments that devote a lot of attention and money to promote these vieos. There's a huge network of garbage human beings that lend each other their audiences and given each other publicty and support. There's a huge political angle and yuo can tap into a very large audience of angry Americans who really hate women for not sleeping with them.

Compare: How many of Katie's articles have forty thousand views? How much support does she have and how much publicity does she get compared to the averge incel? Has she ever been featured prominently on Reddit or is her harrassment the most well-known part of her online work?

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Going back to my previous posts: There's little we can do to stop or confront this industry of hate. Youtube won't take this video down, just like they don't take down all other alt-right videos and all the assholes and shills will keep plunging into Reddit. You are not going to achieve anything arguing with idiots on Twitter. All these attempts are ineffective. You won't get a website back after it has been taken by nazis, either. It's a fool's errand.

What I think is effective is the creation of positive spaces. And it is effective in the most important of terms: It lets people actually play the games and it allows them to read and discuss them without a Damocles sword hanging over them.

It's also important because it bypasses all the hate. You don't have to swim upwards and asks for several "members of the community" to be banned. It doesn't create resentment and negative attention from those who liked it better when "the blacks" kept their head down.

Because, here's the thing: Women are required to go through a lot of garbage to get through the hobby. The best source of computer roleplaying games in the internet is the RPGCodex, which also happens to be a place where people make anti-semictic Anita Sarkeesian jokes. The best information on arcade games is on Shmups system 11, which is full of Gamergaters and other bigots. If you want to play train games, you'll be stared down and patronized by grumpy hateful men and so on. Positive spaces help people gain access to the hobby without having to wade through all the hateful garbage.

I don't know if you guys have noticed, but much of the hate or disdain towards Shut Up and Sit Down gets is rooted in them bypassing the typical BGG audience and not overlooking sexist crap.

I know it's silly, but it's something I think a lot when writing. Now that I've been learning how to use the 18XX Moderator I can't help but think about writing a guide so people can also learn it without using Yahoo Groups or asking the curmudgeons at BGG.

Great post Erik